Mt Whitney Zone Forums The Chat Room Monumentally Stupid Politician

Here is a thoughtful read.

Surrogate

History

Ken,

I'm not a Latin scholar by no means but if I'm not mistaken we cannot pass any ex post facto laws in this country. Therefore, the doctors being murderers for the last 50 years thingy does not apply.

Sorry to get in the way of a good rant.

We aren't talking about legal issues, we are talking about viewpoints. According to the viewpoints of some fundamentalists, virtually all doctors are mass murderers (their words), and so it is justifiable to terminate their lives to stop them. This would be for prescribing, for example, birth control pills.

The doctors who have been killed for performing legal medical procedures are just as dead, whatever the legal (and applicable latin) might say.

I must say Ken, you are the absolute best at throwing up straw men and knocking them down. Bravo.

As they say, where you stand, depends upon where you sit.

Your perspective might be different with a target upon your back.

I had a discussion with my, lets say rightish, brother some time back. He kept using "murder" until I informed him that murder is the "unlawful" taking of a human life by another human,
and since abortion is legal in this country, he needed to stop using the word "murder". He stopped. Now he just uses "killing".

Some fundamentalists. Gee whiz, who cares. Some liberals are big on infanticide...say like liberal ethicist Peter Singer and our President, if his vote while in the Illinois legislature means anything, the latter isn't an issue because the press in this country tilts decidedly left...see Arthur Brisbane in the NYT this past weekend. A majority of those who do not believe abortion should be legal do not believe doctors to be murderers. Most religious people and all mainline churches denounce those who murder doctors. The last I looked, there is a commandment...Thou shall not murder. That applies to doctors who preform abortions the last time I checked the catechism.

This is all part of ginned up issue on part of the Obama Campaign to secure one of its base components...young single women...married women with children vote Republican.

Akin has been a nice narcissistic punching bag for both right and left.

Again, sorry to get in the way of a good rant.

An entertaining way to close a rant that includes the myth of the liberal media.

There are two major issues that have gotten quite convoluted on this thread.

One is Akin's view that women can't get pregnant from being forcibly raped. Which is just downright stupid.

The other issue is abortion. And both sides have merit. And it is a legitimate legal and constitutional issue. If a fetus is an individual human life, then it is morally wrong to kill it and it is entitled to constitutional protection.

If it is not an individual human life, then there really isn't any moral issue and clearly women have the right to do whatever they want with whatever parasitic amorphous mass of cells happens to be in their body.

There are some people who believe that the individual human life begins at conception. There are some people who believe that it isn't an individual human life until it has breached the womb. I personally think that both ends of the spectrum are wrong. But I can't prove my point of view any more than anybody else can prove theirs.

But if somebody believes that individual human life begins at conception, that an embryo is a person, can they really be blamed for wanting to protect that life in the same way anybody would want to protect a baby, child or whatever living human.

And if someone doesn't believe that the embryo or fetus is an individual human life, can they be blamed for wanting to fight for the rights of the woman who we know is a "person"?

Both sides have merit.

Oh, and I registered as a Libertarian in 1983. I registered as a Republican in April 2012.

What day will the first storm hit this year that will leave a foot of snow at trail camp?

I say Nov 3

tdtz,

I have got to support you. You are fighting an uphill battle on this board.

I remember not too long ago how I got shot down for making a small reference to something political and how the entire thread disappeared from this board. I promised Steve C. I would never mention a political reference again....well Steve C....I'm breaking my promise...I've been watching these men fight over this subject for too long. I was a Democrat for years. I am a registered Republican now ...effective in 2007.

The pill was a big deal when I was in my teens because everyone wanted to have tons of sex without any obligations to their partner or to a child. If a child was conceived it was all too easy to abort. I never aborted but I never conceived either because I was always being so careful not to get pregnant until I found Mr. Just Right. I finally found him and I even thought I was pregnant at one time, but it turned out to not be so. Children are so precious. I don't know why anyone would want to abort something so precious just fora the sake of their lifestyle. If someone has a certain lifestyle they want to live without children then they should be careful and take measures to prevent pregnancy. I think people need to grow up and take responsibilty for their lives and for any lives they create. We are all acting like a bunch of spoiled brats always trying to have everything "our way".

Wazzu, when I saw your name on this thread I was so proud of you. I wanted to step in so many times but I was too chicken to take on all these guys after they put me down for being a Redie in a Blue State.

I love the Whitney Zone and everyone on the Whitney Zone.

Peace Not War

Okay, I will also weigh in on behalf of Steve and in lesser cases, myself. We stand back and try to allow free based conversations to flourish, but, when it starts to get personal, the dilemma sets in. Due to philosophical conversations that ran amuck in the past, there are people two years later who will still not speak to each other (as they pass on the trail). The disagreements/hurt runs deep. In some cases, the damage is permanent, and potential friendships are destroyed before they ever set seed. I hate to see an interruption in the synergy of the board, and hopefully folks remember that whenever you tread into the Gun Control, Capital Punishment, Abortion territory, there is going to be a whole lot of emotion and a lesser amount of fact to support the various sides of the arguments.

PS I would really like to see an early snow like in Oct 2, 2010, because that would indicate a potentially good year for the watershed.

I think we have seen enough of everyone's personal views on the several topics here. Thank you Bee for pointing out how political discussions can turn otherwise good friends into enemies.

Just reading the opinions in this thread make me uneasy. I have strong opinions in this area, too, but there is no way I will write them here.

So at this point, I'm locking this thread. Let it fade away as another lesson.