Mt Whitney Zone Forums General Discussion Advice for Newbies in late June

We got our permit for a day hike June 23 for a group of 4 of us!! YAY!!! We are all experienced outdoors-man and have done extensive hikes and camping (including 50+ milers). However, we have not really ever done snow hikes. The closest snow hike was my brother and I hiked up Mammoth Mountain when it was closed, but snow still covered the top half of the mountain. We started at Canyon Lodge and followed the chair lift up, then over and up Waterfall and Dry Creek, and finishing by going straight up Cornice Bowl (40 degree angle). We did this with no equipment and in about 3.5 hours (3100' climb). With it being late June, there will most likely still be snow on the mountain. And this is no Mammoth Mountain. Any advice or preparations we should make?

We were all going to get crampons and trekking poles (converted ski poles). Are ice axes overkill for this time of year? I know they are recommended for May summits. Are crampons also slightly overkill for late June?

We are also planning on starting at 3:30-4:00 am and using the Mount Whitney Trail.

Thanks!

Your dates are still several weeks away, and a lot can change in terms of conditions. The snow pack in the Whitney area seems about average, and typically by late June crampons are needed only thru the switchbacks in the early morning. The best advice I can give you is monitor the trip reports on the two Whitney BB's for conditions. And I'll put in a plug re: trip reports - tell us what the conditions are! It's fine to hear you had a great time, and cousin Johnny kept you up all night snoring, but ... give specific info about snow levels, ice, etc.

At this point, plan on crampons unless it's reasonably certain the trails have melted out. And, bring poles, but as for an ice axe? Do you know how to use it for self-arrest? If not, then only bring one if you plan to use it as a brake when glissading, as otherwise it's unnecessary weight.

Hope everything works out and your group has a great time.

You can't self arrest with trekking poles. If you have fangs on your feet, you should have an axe in your uphill hand. If the trail, there are some other options for traction. If not, the only way up and down is the chute.

Only the Lord know what conditions will be like come 6/23. At this point, you should be preparing for the worst.

I don't agree with that as it's too simplistic. There are many instances where the grade is such that you need crampons to avoid slipping, but a fall is unlikely to result in injury. Under these circumstances, poles do a much better job of maintaining your balance than an ice axe, and the whole point is to avoid falling.

The people most likely to make mistakes as to when this gear is supposed switched into and out of; therefore, it makes sense to have and use the prescribed gear. I believe people who are clueless to the actually risks should not take the short cut you suggest. Anyway, what's BD Raven ice axe weigh? Less than a couple of pounds? If you are not prepared to carry 20+# for a day hike this time of year, you really should not be on this mountain.

Also, neither you nor I know what the conditions will be in late June. I do know I have used ice axe and crampons later than this in the Sierra after big winters followed by cool springs.

My first post was rather clear on that point -

Just to be clear, the chute is the alternate way to get from Trail Camp to Trail Crest in case the "99 Switchbacks" are impassible, correct?

As for the ice axe issue, none of us have been trained to do self-arrests, so if the only way up is via the chute, would it be smart to turn back?

We are very aware of present dangers during our adventures and never push ourselves into dangerous situations. We know when to turn back, and are not overconfident. With that being said, is this something that only experienced ice climbs should attempt? We would feel confident on most any slope that was less than a 45 degree incline.

We know it is impossible to tell what the weather or snow level will be on our trip, but just recommendations on different situations would be helpful. Would lashing the group together be a good idea, in case one person slips, the weight of everyone else will prevent the slip turning into a fall?

Thanks for all the responses so far!!

Yes, the "chute" is the other way. Here is the switchbacks picture Bob Rockwell took, and Wayne Pyle has annotated.

Click on the picture for the full-size version. Then click on the full-size picture to enlarge. Look at the upper right corner to see the switchbacks, as well as the slope to the right (the "chute"). The streaks are the glissade tracks of people using that method to descend.




Watch for current reports closer to your trip.


It may be as easy as this -- Here's a picture from Richard P from a hike in October (link):


I don't think roping together is ever recommended on this slope. Here's a recent thread covering the same topic, where the slope angle is described as ~38 degrees:
  june 18th - 1st time summiting

That photo was so helpful!!! It is definitely better to see what you are trying to accomplish rather than just descriptions. I really appreciate all the advice, and I will definitely update everyone on the conditions when we get back.

The chute is the only way until the trail is beaten in by the persistent. At my last look, the snowpack in the southern Sierra was 160% of normal for that date. What that will become in late June is anyone's guess at this time. It all depends on the spring heat.

Only you can make the call, whether or not you should or should not climb the chute. All we can do is offer advice based on experience. I always advise, come go as far as you can safely descend. You will have a good time. However, coming from the east with all the associated expense, I would think twice about doing it, if it were me.

Many people do the chute with zero experience but it is not something I can recommend, I've seen one too many accidents in these conditions, including a one of my own.

Like Steve, I do not believe roping up group of inexperienced folks is wise.

Yeah, we are coming up from Long Beach, so we are going to be hiking it regardless. It's just a matter of whether we summit or not. Thanks for the advice of not roping together. I guess we will just see what its like when we get there, and of course update everyone else when we get back down.

Some of the posts seem to imply that people climb the chute because the switchbacks are a pain (or worse) with snow on them. In my view, the switchbacks are a huge pain under any conditions. I prefer the chute any time there is enough snow to cover the rocks. The fastest way to Trail Crest is to hike up the chute with crampons when the snow is nice and firm.

The concept of tieing in with a rope seems like a good idea on it's face, however, the reality is something quite different.

To stop the fall of a person to whom you are tied, requires much better technique and presence of mind than a solo situation. In reality, for inexperienced people, it is likely to mean the whole group rocketing down the mountain out of control and unstoppable. An example of this, with three, including a highly skilled mountaineering professional:
(Kurt's on Rainier, for those who have seen it before)

http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/arctic-void-2275/Overview#tab-Videos/06859_00

Stopping others by an ice axe belay starts to move into the realm of heroics. The greatest example of this is known simply in mountaineering lore, as "The Belay" (google it):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Schoening

Today, The Belay is considered to be one of the most famous events in mountaineering history. Schoening's ice axe is currently on display at the Bradford Washburn American Mountaineering Museum in Golden, Colorado.

Schoening's actions clearly saved the lives of five of his climbing partners.[4] He was awarded the David A. Sowles Memorial Award for his heroics by the American Alpine Club in 1981 as a "mountaineer who has distinguished himself, with unselfish devotion at personal risk or sacrifice of a major objective, in going to the assistance of fellow climbers imperiled in the mountains."