Mt Whitney Zone Forums General Discussion Grand Canyon- Rim to Rim interest?

This seemed like a good place to start- is there anyone out there interested in doing a rim to rim hike of the grand canyon? I an avid hiker from So Cal and have logged numerous hours hiking Whitney, San G, Baldy etc. and would like to try the inverted mountain.

I went to the Grand Canyon when I was 8 and peered down from the top. At that time my parents were stopped from taking two children under the age of 10 down to the bottom and back up (thank you sane rangers.) Now I actually want to do it.

I am looking to do this sometime in the fall but I am not doing this one alone.

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Edit: More Rim-to-Rim discussion
Grand Canyon, Rim to Rim, Car swap
Grand Canyon Rim to Rim
Grand Canyon Rim-to-Rim 5-16-2013

What are your plans? South to North, or North to South? You planning on taking a shuttle back to the car on the other side, or are you interested in possibly doing a rim to rim to rim so you can end up where you started?

I am potentially interested - I want to do a rim to rim as my next grand canyon adventure. Last year my brother and I went from the south rim to the bottom, then back up. We took the South Kaibab trail down, spent 1 night at Bright Angel Campground then took the Bright Angel Trail up and spent a night on the way up at Indian Gardens. It was a great trip!

Hi Bryan- thanks for replying! Sounds like you and your brother enjoyed your trip enough to do it again which is promising.

I have not made any plans yet and believe me, I will research it to death once I start. I have a coworker who has done the rim to rim - in one consecutive run. This kind of challenge interests me. Currently I am just starting to look at the options of the trails and (most importantly) the time of the year for trail conditions.

What do you think? Is this crazy talk?

After my Whitney hike this year I was researching rim to rim for next year. I have found hitthetrail.com to have loads of useful info on GC hiking. My plan is to hike from north to south, staying the night at Phantom Ranch and exiting via BA trail. PR dorm gets reserved one year in advance and if you are lucky you will get last minute cancellations.

Good luck.

Stalin

I think "Whitney Fan" here is planning on doing a R-2-R this fall. I am hoping he'll give us some details of his plans.

Part of the planning includes the transportation and lodging. It would be quite advantageous of two groups would work together, with one starting at one side and the other the opposite. Exchange cars before, then exchange keys mid-hike and drive back/meet somewhere afterwards.

I've made several Trans-Sierra day hikes using that method.

Steve- thanks for the great idea about the car key switch! I know that lodging is a problem and was hoping to get around it with the hike through. I will do some due diligence before regarding trails and maybe I can drum up some interest.

Cheers!

Steve is correct in remembering that I'm planning a rim to rim day hike. It's scheduled for Wednesday, October 3.

I've been procrastinating a little on jumping in on this thread, sort of looking for when I'd have a little time to type things out.

The planning and preparation for the hike are legitimately part of a "trip report", and that's what I can address now, and it will hopefully be informative to others considering this hike.

But -- I'm procrastinating again right now! Hope to have a little more time tomorrow to pitch in!

Nope, I don't think it's crazy talk at all - I've heard of many people doing it this way. Strictly by the numbers, it would actually be very comparable to a Whitney day hike (at lower elevation, of course). Going down the South Kaibab Trail is about 7 miles, and it's 14 miles up the North Kaibab - and about 5500 ft of elevation gain. Total of 21 miles, 5500 ft of gain, and the overall lower elevation should make it a fair bit easier than a Whitney day hike.

That being said, I think it would be a good idea to consider spending a night at the bottom if your schedule allows. We took our time on our trip, and I still wished we had a couple extra nights to play with. When we got to the bottom and started talking to other people, we learned about some really beautiful day hikes from the Phantom Ranch area that I would have liked to have done.

right now planning for south to north one way via south/north kaibab on 10-01-12, returning to south rim via van shuttle service

sssss, where will you spend the night after completing the hike, before you can catch the shuttle?

grand canyon lodge north rim

OK, as promised, here is some input that will address my upcoming Grand Canyon rim to rim day hike.

Not quite sure where this writing will take me. Just know I want it to be interesting, helpful. Feel free to ask questions, either here or via PM. I'll post in this thread up until the time I actually go on the hike, then I'll post in the "Trip Reports" section.

And I'll warn in advance -- my mantra is to never write 10 words when 1000 will do better! :)

You need to evaluate what I say in the context of knowing a little about me, so you can best determine how what I say might apply to your own plans.

I'm 67, 6 feet tall, 150 to 160 pounds. I'm in pretty good shape. I walk or jog 2 or 3 miles a day (and I'll later tell you what I'm doing to train for the rim to rim).

Like Laura, I consider myself to be -- if not the luckiest guy (not gal) in the world, pretty darn close. I moved to fabulous Las Vegas from Orlando, Florida 5 1/2 years ago.
I could write forever about WHY it's so great to live here, but for purposes of Whitney Zone, and everyone's prime interest, ONE reason is the WEALTH of outdoors
opportunities in every direction from here and relatively close by. (If and when I win MegaBucks (currently about $ 13,900,000) I'll then know FOR SURE that I'm the luckiest
guy in the world!)

I am not a backpacker (meaning, to my mind, sleeping overnight in the outdoors). I'm not even a full fledged hiker in the sense that it's my prime avocation. It isn't. (That honor goes to being a restaurant hound. And I have other interests that also probably weigh in ahead of hiking, like travel, for instance.) But -- hiking and the love of the outdoors IS a strong peripheral interest.

The hiking activity probably started when I day hiked Whitney in 2004 at age 59. The travel interest at that point had exposed me to -- besides all mainland 48 states, all
except 4 state capitals, half the major league baseball parks, 30 of the 45 national parks within the continental US -- the lowest point in Death Valley (Badwater). The thought came to me -- if I've been to the lowest point, shouldn't I go to the highest point as yet another "bucket list" goal? So, I started researching online. It's doable -- NOT a technical climb. But it's nonetheless a challenge. And what's this? Doing it in a day? You're ON! The goal had been formed.

Continuing this "here is me" talk to, again, put what I have to say about the Grand Canyon rim to rim in context . . .

My Whitney day hike started at 4:00 AM, I summited at 12:45 PM, left the summit at 1:50 PM, back to the portal at 6:42 PM. Coming from lowland Florida, I DID acclimatize
over 3 or 4 days before the hike. My hydration concept was to pack 6 20 oz. Gatorades (of which I only drank 5). (I didn't want the hassle of water sources study, taking time to purify, etc. My concept might well be different next time, especially with learning how pure the water is on Whitney.)

(I preferably would like to post an 8 year old trip report -- unfortunately my source (emails to friends and family) for that was destroyed in a computer meltdown.)

When I did Whitney, I timed a major physical about the same time, while my body was lean and mean from the Whitney training. I do a major physical every three years, so I
fell into the habit of conceptually planning both events -- a major hike and my major physical -- every 3 years. I actually didn't do a big hike 3 years later in 2007, but DID one in 2009 (well -- "roughly" every 3 years!) and am now planning the rim to rim in 2012. (I'm tentatively planning the Mountaineer's Route on Whitney for 2015 at age 70.)

Mt. Charleston in 2009 (Southern Nevada's highest peak at some 12,950 feet) was a 6:00 AM start and finishing the whole shebang (18 miles round trip) about 3:30 PM. (I live at 3,200 feet elevation, was told by others that there was no need for acclimatization, found out that was the way it might work while doing some other climbs in the Charleston vicinity, and that's the way it DID work out.)

I've done Griffith Peak, Turtlehead Peak, Frenchman Mountain, Lone Mountain here locally, along with other mountains and other trails -- maybe 15 to 20 different things. I've done Camelback Mountain in Phoenix. Now that I think about it, Mt. Hunger in Vermont, 4 peaks in the Adirondacks (NY) much earlier in life.

So let's talk about the rim to rim effort now that you can paint what I'll say in the context of knowing who's speaking.

Arguably, it may be more fun to do the rim to rim over 2 or more days, but just like my Whitney hike, I like the challenge of doing it in a day. So that's what I selected.

If you're looking into this hike at all, and done any research, you've discovered that while the North Kaibab trail is the only corridor trail from the North Rim you have two choices when it comes to connecting with the South Rim -- the South Kaibab Trail and the Bright Angel trail. You also have the choice of going from north to south or south to north.

I decided on going from north to south. The prime advantage is less uphill hiking in that the North Rim is some 1,500 feet higher than the South Rim. And I decided on using the Bright Angel Trail coming up -- advantage is that while it's a little longer than the South Kaibab it's not as steep (duh!) AND it avoids exiting a fair distance away from the South Rim hotels.

You may have also found out that the TIMING of the hike is critical. It's hellaciously hot in the canyon much of the year. May and September/October are the prime times to hike. You know from my earlier post -- I decided October 3. (Before selecting that exact date I researched sunrise, sunset, moonrise, and moonset times for that and other late September/early October dates.)

You've also found -- or will know now -- that some of the logistics for a rim to rim are a little tricky. The only way back to the rim from where you started is to hike across the canyon again OR take a shuttle (or have some sort of driving arrangement with private vehicles worked out in advance with friends or family, as Steve pointed out).

I'll be using the shuttle. It's a 215 mile 4 1/2 hour drive around the eastern end of the canyon. $ 85. Go here: http://www.trans-canyonshuttle.com/ Note that reservations are REQUIRED. (I plan on calling them about a month before my hike.)

Another reality is that -- unless you will be camping or sleeping in your own vehicle at EACH rim (sleep, hike in one day, sleep again, back to the other rim), you have to make reservations at hotel facilities EARLY. It's recommended up to a year in advance. While you may get away with less time than that I didn't chance it. I made my reservations LAST YEAR in the summer! There is only ONE hotel on the North Rim -- the Grand Canyon Lodge. Go here: http://www.grandcanyonlodgenorth.com/ You have a number of choices on the South Rim -- but the number of folks THERE as opposed to the North Rim is MUCH higher, so you can't delay making your reservation there either. Go here: http://www.grandcanyonlodges.com/ Note that one booking company takes reservations for all places on the South Rim and a separate company for the one place on the North Rim. (And --if you DO want to do something other than sleep in hotels you're on your own with your research -- I didn't look into that.)

Yet another logistical oddity is that the trailhead for the North Kaibab trail is a mile or three from the hotel (can't remember the exact distance and too lazy to Google it up again!). Whether it's one or three is irrelevant -- I don't think you want to hike this in addition to the 24 MILES from rim to rim, do you? The hotel offers a complimentary
shuttle to the trailhead but only twice a day. What times? Will they work for your hike planning? Last information I had was that one of those times was at 5:45 AM, which works for me because my planned hike start time is 6:00 AM. Also, when I check in the day before the hike, I will be looking at a medium sized parking lot (free) that is near the trailhead to visually ensure it's not too far from the trailhead AND is not about to be crammed with cars if I decide to use it the next morning. So I'm giving myself an option here. To use the shuttle, you have RESERVE it at least a day ahead. I will be calling to do that from Las Vegas before I drive there.

Are we having fun yet?

My detailed plans . . . I leave Las Vegas on October 2 to check in to the North Rim Grand Canyon Lodge in the late afternoon. Hike day -- leave at 6:00 AM. After much
thinking my best guess estimate for finishing time for the hike (15 miles down, 10 miles up) is NLT 7:00 or 7:30 PM. Sleep overnight (I'll be at the Bright Angel Lodge, right
NEXT to the trailhead I'll be exiting the canyon from), and catch that shuttle at 1:30 pm the next day, arriving back on the North Rim at 6:00 PM (it stops at BOTH the hotel AND that parking lot). I plan to drive directly back to Las Vegas then.

I'm going to put 4 20 oz. Gatorades in my pack for this hike. Your research will show that there are -- also -- multiple water sources on both trails. Food will be some GORP
and/or a bunch of Cliff bars. (I'll be looking forward to a NICE meal (with BEER!) at one of the many attractive dining choices available on the South Rim after the hike.)

If you knew what I know about those sky object set and rise times you'll know that I need to take a headlamp with me for
the hike. I will be! (Make sure you check all that out for yourself too. Even if you think you can do the whole shebang in daylight you still want a headlamp in case your estimate of time is way off or you run into an emergency.)

Emergency? I will -- and you should too -- let someone know what your planned finish time is, and give them an emergency contact # to start a search and rescue if they don't
hear from you by a certain time. For me -- I'm adding 3 hours to my planned NLT finish time. That time -- 10:30 ARIZONA time (adjust if your contact is in a different time
zone)-- will be the time for my contact to call emergency (haven't got that number yet, one thing I've got to confirm yet). Besides the right number to call, she will have my planned hike itinerary information, where my car will be (with it's description), where I'm staying, etc. You know the drill . . .

What haven't we talked about yet? Acclimatization? (In fact, the relative elevations for this hike are one bonus in comparison to the higher ones for Whitney.) For me, it won't be necessary. But -- the North Kaibab trailhead is still at about 8,500 feet. If you're a lowlander I would recommend, minimally, staying for a few days at that elevation before your hike. (When I did Whitney, flying in to California from lowland Florida, I drove to the Sierra directly from taking a cruise literally at sea level. I drove to Mammoth Lakes
at -- also -- about 8,500 feet. Stayed there for 2 or 3 days (with a side jaunt to White Mountain and 2 hikes through the Bristlecone pines and one hike from the gate to the Barcroft station and back -- oh, had a flat tire at 11,000 feet before all that!, drove to Lone Pine, went up to Lone Pine Lake and back that same day, stayed at the Dow Villa, next day hung around the portal, next day the hike. Buried in all that detail -- my head was REAL light in Mammoth Lakes that first night. As I stated -- I would recommend if you're coming from a lower elevation to give yourself a few days at 8,500 feet before your hike.)

Training for the hike? Gosh, we all have our own ideas for that sort of thing. Here's what I do. It's been a consistent regimen for any of my bigger hikes (that every 3 years thing). When I contemplated the 22 miles round trip for Whitney in a day back in 2004 I first thought -- but I've never hiked over 5 miles (and that was as a Boy Scout a LONG time ago). So I knew I at least had to hike 22 miles before Whitney to know I could do it. I first did a 4 mile hike, then a 15 one, then a 22 mile one. And this sort of segues in to my overall regimen.

I start training about 5 or 6 months before the big hike. (Remember, this is in ADDITION to my daily walk and jog routine.) I alternate on weekends (once a week) between:

# 1 -- doing those 22 mile hikes. Nothing sexy, just routes on city streets pre-plotted out. Takes 6 to 6 1/2 hours.

# 2 -- jogging 3 miles. (With 2 of the jogging days 5 mile runs.)

# 3 -- stair climbing. Specifically, here in Las Vegas, going up and down the 17 steps in my 2 story condo 150 times! (Takes about an hour and a half.)

In the last two months before the "big hike" I do all these things (including my daily stuff) with 20 pounds in my backpack. Which is (duh) on my back.

(I TOLD you I like to write!)

I think -- somehow -- my mind has run out of stuff to spit out. Which means, I hope, that most of the stuff that will be informative and helpful to anyone else has hopefully now been put out for you to consider.

If I think of anything else that might be useful to say I'll post again. And, again, feel free to ask question, either here or via PM. Or -- just make comments, especially if you think I'm missing something or should consider something.

Wow! ...looking forward to Chapter 2.  

Looks like the logistics for the rim-to-rim takes quite a bit more planning than a Whitney hike.

logistic nightmare - but it is happening.

i'll see the previous poster's auto trip from las vegas and raise him a round-trip train ride from williams az to the south rim.

we'll drive from ventura county to williams az.

hotel overnight.

grand canyon railway from williams to the south rim.

same day van shuttle from south rim to north rim.

hotel overnight.

hike north rim to south rim.

hotel two overnights.

grand canyon railway from south rim to williams.

hotel overnight.

drive home to ventura county.

for us, the biggest potential fly is october weather scratching the hike and/or van ride.

Steve, regarding the logistics planning -- 'taint NEARLY so bad as my Everest trip was. (Not! In my dreams . . . )

Our local newspaper columnist specializing in the outdoors/hiking/backpacking just recently did rim to rim over several days and published an article about it. I emailed her to touch base, and she responded back with an answer I'd asked regarding the ability to get Gatorade at the Phantom Ranch Cantina at the bottom of the canyon. (She said it was right next to the trail.)

She also said both snacks and beverages were available -- wasn't sure if Gatorade per se was part of the mix, though she suspected that, if not, they likely had at least powder to mix with water.

I checked http://www.grandcanyonlodges.com/dining-712.html and see that, also, both snacks and beverages are mentioned. If cold Gatorade is available it will be preferable for me or anyone else in lieu of Gatorade or other warmer beverages. And this might be factored in one's packing decisions for their pack.

Note at this site -- accessibility is apparently not possible during meal serving hours (meals REQUIRE reservations). (For me, I should be able to get a cold drink, as my likely time passing by this place will easily be between the published meal hours.)

Also note (anyone planning this hike) - you can reserve "sack lunches" here. (You might go this route in lieu of packing some food.)

What happened to "monkie onmy back", "BryanB"? Anyone else planning near term for this hike?

Right now I don't have a date planned to do a Rim to Rim - I need to find someone to join me. If someone from this forum is going and doesn't mind me tagging along, I'm game - as long as I can work it into my schedule. Personally, I'd prefer to spend a night at the bottom and not try to do it all in a day.

I don't recall there being cold bottled Gatorade at Phantom Ranch, but they do sell electrolyte powder to mix into water. As far as beverages at the Cantina, DO NOT miss the lemonade! I know it sounds silly, but the lemonade at Phantom Ranch is probably the best I've ever had! It is very sweet, so if you're not a fan of drinks full of sugar, it's probably not for you.

Also, there are some neat patches, pins, t-shirts, etc that you can buy ONLY at Phantom Ranch - so maybe reserve some space in your pack to haul a souvenir or two out. If you're really against the extra weight, and don't mind paying a few extra bucks, you can mail stuff home from the post office at Phantom Ranch.

Also, forgot to mention that the sack lunches are a great deal and you should definitely reserve one! It'll save food weight and it's a really nice package of all different types of food and snacks.

I think mine had a bagel and cream cheese, summer sausage, various crackers/cookies/trail mix, raisins, fresh apple, granola bar and a packet of electrolyte powder.

As it gets closer to my hike, it looks like I may be able to contribute more useful information for any potential rim to rimmers.

Today I called Trans-Canyon Shuttle to make my reservation for the 1:30 PM October 4 departure from the South Rim to the North Rim (arriving at 6:00 PM). (Incidentally, the shuttle leaves from exactly where I'll be staying the night before after my hike -- Bright Angel Lodge.)

I learned that they do not accept a credit card, only cash or a check. I was asked to send $ 45 via snail mail to confirm the reservation with the remaining $ 40 ($ 85 total fare) due at ride time. They will mail me a confirmation letter (and a confirmation # was given over the phone).

The gentleman I talked with was very friendly and accomodating -- I remembered his voice from a call last year getting VERY preliminary information!

BryanB -- appreciate the information about Phantom Ranch.

I'm from SoCal and am interested in doing Rim to Rim. It probably won't happen this year, so I plan to start looking into it this fall after we're done with the hikes we have planned for this summer are finished (we have Whitney, San G (again) and C2C left).

I did a day hike of the Grand Canyon a few years ago, back then I was just kinda along for the ride, but I believe we did South Rim (down South Kaibab trail and up the Bright Angel Trail).


The two 'barriers' for me so far have been the logistics issues (Whitney Fan's post about the shuttle helps with is) and finding someone to do it with me.

Monkie
If you are up for a R2R2R, you can go s to n one day, stay overnight on the north rim and hike n to s the next day. I did this 3 years ago and it is not as difficult as it sounds. If you want to hotel it on the north rim, you will need to do it before they close down in Nov for the winter.